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Zestygoobs

T5 material drops

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Endgame players can probably agree or disagree (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ that endgame crafting went from a serious grind to a complete snoozefest. The chests in T9 dungeons felt super rewarding before T5 was implemented, Everyone would be very excited to see one just to ping and hope for a rare T8 material drop. Now you can spend 1 hour farming materials for about 40 sable. Prices for materials were in a good place but now everything is worthless by how common and easy everything is. I have barley tried to farm and I have like 1.5k enriched metals after constantly crafting items, I have so much I had to create a mule character just to hold them all. First world problems.

I understand the need for obtaining better resources for end game players, but T5 dropping was to much. I could totally see T3 material drops being much more practical and would bring back chests feeling rewarding and end game crafting. Please swap the T5 for T3. Thanks :D

As always if you have constructive feedback Id love to hear why you agree or disagree.

Edited by Zestygoobs
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While it is true that t5 materials dropping might be a bit overpowered I do think there needs to be a balance struck that enables for a bit of a "farming" requirement without gifting a lot of t5 mats. I think t3 materials dropping in t9 dungeons rather than t5 could certainly be a solution, or simply dropping stacks of t1 materials!

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Personally think the t1 mats were abit grindy but overall fine. Some other possibilities: 

1.) t5 / t3 mats still dropped at MUCH lower rates

2.) t10 could drop t5 / t3 mat stacks at low %. 

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Definitely some good points, but hard to find a balance. I like the idea of t3 dropping in hard-modes while potentially still having t5s drop in t10. Will agree that is hard to find a balance.

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Yeah I could see T5 dropping "rarely" in T10 and T3 dropping in T9's. This makes sense to me, but currently its way to much.

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Thanks for the feedback, everyone! I'll pass this along to the folks who balance these stats and check if it's possible that something went awry - if not, we'll look into rebalancing accordingly.

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It is a little odd, isn't it...

Everything drops T0 raw materials until suddenly we're giving you T5. We skip dropping T1 and T3 entirely.

Thinking this sounds reasonable:

  • T9 enemies will drop T1 materials at an increase of the current rate, with a chance for T3
  • T10 enemies will drop T3 materials at the current rate, with a chance for T5

It will take me a few days to carve out enough time to make these updates, so let's say anyone that wants to weight in and offer their thoughts has 48 hours to do so. Too far? Not far enough? I'll do what I think is best for the game, but I'm curious what people think (even though I'm not sharing specific numbers). And I am not an unreasonable person that cannot be swayed by good arguments (usually; sometimes I'm just a stubborn jerk).

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I think the issue is that the end game just stagnates, so all these "Materials" aren't really going anywhere... particularly if people are being stingy and saving their best gear whenever they go down the well. The game absolutely is not friendly for players who are unable to really bring friends into the game and have trouble with meeting people with a similar timezone, so having higher grade materials drop late game would be ideal and fairly welcome in my opinion, considering I personally still haven't even attempted T8 yet out of fear of losing gear I probably spent about 400 bloodstone from the supporter packs on despite going for serious "discounts" as much as possible.

If crafting was a bit more of a viable option for me I'd probably risk going into stuff like hardmode more often, despite the fact crafting costs an arm and a leg + 6 hours of your life... and if I knew that the drops for t5 were apparently so appallingly common in t9 I'd have jumped in and farmed the crap out of it to get rid of all my garbage t0 that is wasting space in my Vault. If you're getting too many mats, just don't pick them up (or throw them away before leaving, at least until the market comes back) or treat higher tiered gear like as though it is less precious and make "spares" for things like the well or solo attempts of end game dungeons.

Just as a reminder, this isn't a typical MMO where having end game gear makes you untouchable, it is a Rogue-lite (because you can store things), where you lose everything you currently have on you upon death. So you should treat it more like a roguelike when you're actually at the point where you have the supplies to care less about end game gear and play less carefully to take risks and feel far less frustrated if you die since all you have to do is bring your character back up to 25 and re-equip them with end game gear... which with friends able to boost you in later dungeons should be easy. And honestly, if having too many materials is a freaking problem, start up a project like making a Penta wave t10 weapon where you'll have to deal with horrible rng that somehow despite having a 1/4 chance, I've failed what feels like 30-50 times in a row to grab imprints off items.

 

Finally, here's the part where instead of simply complaining, I actually throw my own coin into the mix on how I feel things could be improved. The original complaint essentially said that chests weren't rewarding since you got t5 gear from the monsters, so the simplest solution for that isn't to nerf something, but instead to simply make chests actually rewarding all-round. Simply put, Chests are nearly pointless until t6 once you have 10 HP and Energy potions as the silver they give you is barely noticeable and they don't offer any kind of reward outside of "rare" materials until t6 where they'll start giving out charms on rare occasions. The solution is to simply add a little more silver onto the pile (you did just fight a wave of slightly more powerful enemies), Make charms more common and have it that higher leveled charms can show up at later tiers and to have a chance for imprints and imprinted gear to show up in chests. The pool of Imprints would likely be restricted to the tier, so people wouldn't just be able to farm t2 or t3 for the best imprints and have special imprints that can only ever show up in later tiers that would be far rarer, could only be imprinted on t10(+?) gear and would make people a whole lot more excited than "Oh great, t5 mats that I had the drop rate nerfed to make finding these exciting again". As for the drops of mats, why not have t9 drop t5, t8 drop t3 and t7 drop t1? Allowing people who aren't so rich in resources to just spam end game dungeons to catch up ever so slightly quicker? T7 is of course the first actual difficulty spike in the game since the "adds" there really drank their redbull & protein shakes before taking you on, so it'd make sense as to where that'd be where the tiers would start. As for t10, it might even be best to turn off material drops and make it that attempting it would be solely for the rewards, or do something with it to make it more unique or challenging, perhaps having different keys for it with different levels of "handicap" that each have different drop rates & end game rewards, having harder difficulties drop stuff that might be able to further enhance t10 gear and have one that'd works kinda similarly to the Well in the sense that to use the key you'd have to have end game gear specifically made to enter it (probably having it that the gear only gives you stats inside the dungeon, and maybe can't be taken off until either death or completing the "nightmare raid"), so if you die in the attempt, you're forced to lose that gear and have to re-earn it. This extends the endgame further beyond just t10 and makes it more grindy so that end game players who can afford to spam what should be expensive end-game content won't complain about slightly "less end-game" content as they'll absolutely need those materials as fodder for something far more expensive.

I apologise if it sounded like I was giving sass or something, but I'm fairly tired of people complaining about high tier'd stuff dropping in end game situations, it feels kinda like people are barking in the wrong direction as you could just as well say "Lower the drop rates to make it less common" instead of wishing for crappier items in higher amounts.

@9R_RyanJ Just in case you don't end up looking back at this before doing anything serious, although it sounds like my input won't really amount to nothing.

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Posted (edited)
On 1/7/2019 at 6:24 PM, 9R_RyanJ said:

It is a little odd, isn't it...

Everything drops T0 raw materials until suddenly we're giving you T5. We skip dropping T1 and T3 entirely.

Thinking this sounds reasonable:

  • T9 enemies will drop T1 materials at an increase of the current rate, with a chance for T3
  • T10 enemies will drop T3 materials at the current rate, with a chance for T5

It will take me a few days to carve out enough time to make these updates, so let's say anyone that wants to weight in and offer their thoughts has 48 hours to do so. Too far? Not far enough? I'll do what I think is best for the game, but I'm curious what people think (even though I'm not sharing specific numbers). And I am not an unreasonable person that cannot be swayed by good arguments (usually; sometimes I'm just a stubborn jerk).

I think this sounds excellent, Thanks for the hard work.

Edited by Zestygoobs

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I think I want a little more risk vs reward. It makes sense to tone down material drops generally, but I feel like people with good mechanical skill / gameplay technique should still be rewarded with generous drops.

Maybe add an "ultra dangerous chest" in T9 dungeons with SIGNIFICANTLY buffed enemies. Maybe those enemies should drop T5 materials at the current rate, while normal enemies drop T1 materials.

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