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Zilch

Dying and Losing Relics due to server stability

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With server stability being an issue right now, it's just not a good combination when you introduce the new relic system. And don't get me wrong I think the new relic system is great, it gives that 'end-game' feel along with min-maxing opportunities for your character. But the problem is, there's no way to safe-guard that from things we can't control as players.

I'm not saying there shouldn't be a risk of losing relics when dying. The sense of danger and risk is awesome when we're holding gears and relics that we don't want to lose. It's just really frustrating and depressing when you do die and lose the relics when you know you could've survived but due to the servers having issues you still die.

I feel like most players won't mind losing their gear because they probably have some saved up either in their vault or in another character(mule) because they understand that there is a chance that they will die. But with relics you can't really do that, you can't have a safety net and still progress. By that I mean we can't just save our relics and not consume it  and just save it in the vault because it will halt our progression.
 

Personally, I haven't been a victim of this fortunately but I've had a number of in-game friends who fell victim to this and some even completely stopped playing the game because they think it's just not worth the effort anymore after dying a couple times.

Now I'm suggesting this as a temporary band-aid fix but of course it'll be up to the devs if they want to integrate this into the game permanently.

My suggestion would be instead of losing all relics upon death anywhere else other than the well that our relic levels should just be decreased by a certain amount instead of losing all of it. That way there's still the risk of actually losing relics but not all of it. Although with this being implemented I don't think the consumed relics should be account-bound but still character bound and be marked for kin on death. Maybe have the collection of relics to be shown as a 'Tome of Knowledge' or something to that effect that we will then receive in the mailbox like how we receive marked for kin gear. The 'Tome of Knowledge' will be account-bound(can be vaulted) and non-tradable.

I'd need help and ideas from the devs and also players to determine what's a reasonable number of (relics/levels on relics) that we'll lose if ever we do die on a character that has relics on them. I was also thinking about this system only activating when you go past a certain meaningful relic level and if you die below that level you still lose all relics. That way we also have a sense of progression or goal in mind and not just blindly level a type of relic for no reason.

So for example (I'm going to make this simple and just have 1-2 relic type active on a character but the idea will apply to all relic types):

a.) Lets say I had on my character a level 35 Relic of the Mirage Hunter and I died. I would then receive a 'Tome of Knowledge' that will give me maybe a level 30 or a level 25 Relic of the Mirage Hunter upon consuming it.

b.) Lets say I had on my character a level 23 Relic of the Mirage Hunter AND a level 6 Relic of the Kraken and I died. I would then receive a 'Tome of Knowledge' that will give me a level 20 Relic of the Mirage Hunter and since my Relic of the Kraken was too low level, that would just be lost.

 

I strongly believe this is what we need with the new relic system to balance it all out. The current system in place is just too devastating to a point of leaving the game when you've poured countless hours of grinding then just lose everything due to server stability issue. At least by having this kind of system there's still a loss for the player when dying and will make more of an impact when reaching the higher levels of the relics because if you were to die with a level 65 relic on your character and go down 5 relic levels, that's still 200+ relics lost. Which will be unfortunate but won't be as disheartening as losing 1000+ relics.

So that's my suggestion. Please do chime in and share your opinion. 😉

Zilch | Peep

 

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I strongly agree to this, It is very frustrating to die because of a death that is OUT OF OUR CONTROL.

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I think you definitely have some good points. I, myself, haven't had to worry too much about network issues putting me in situations where I am at risk, but I have seen numerous amounts of people who have. I'm not sure how well this would work out, considering it takes away from the perma-death aspect of the game. However, compensation for out-of-player-control issues is something that needs to be addressed in some manner.

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I have posted suggestion recently too, how to prevent dying in lags or when game freezes without change relic system, so it would cost much lower developers resources and time to implement in the game - until they fix lags temporary extend players HP in 2 times. this easy solution wont require to rebalance anything, writing new codes features and stop current development process. Just announce -  its temorary solution and HP in future will be nerfed back, thats all. 

Edited by deadushka
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There must be a feeling that I have become stronger and it is easier and safer for me to play, but the higher the level of my relics the more terrible I am to play.
I'm afraid that I will remain my main character and continue to play another character without relics, and the main character will be like a mannequin with high-level relics.
I don’t think anyone needs such a system.
I also don’t like the T10 in which there is nothing but relics and this is sometimes very annoying.

Screenshot_1.png

Edited by Med0nt
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7 minutes ago, Med0nt said:

There must be a feeling that I have become stronger and it is easier and safer for me to play, but the higher the level of my relics the more terrible I am to play.
I'm afraid that I will remain my main character and continue to play another character without relics, and the main character will be like a mannequin with high-level relics.

Exactly! This is my point when I said:

 

2 hours ago, Zilch said:

I feel like most players won't mind losing their gear because they probably have some saved up either in their vault or in another character(mule) because they understand that there is a chance that they will die. But with relics you can't really do that, you can't have a safety net and still progress. By that I mean we can't just save our relics and not consume it  and just save it in the vault because it will halt our progression.

It halts our progressions because of the fear of losing all of it without any type of consolation. Not to mention if the death was caused by the server being unstable. This is why I only proposed it as a temporary band-aid fix and not a permanent one. When they do fix the servers and it's not as sketchy anymore then I think it's fine that we revert to the current system. But hey, who knows, maybe they'll make it permanent.

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Hey there, Zilch! 

I completely understand your frustration - while death is a big part of Survived By, it's not any fun losing items and relics to deaths that aren't your fault. Loss of relics has become a hot topic for the community this week and we're discussing possible next steps. This is an important issue that we'll definitely keep working through, and I'll be sure to communicate a solution once we've decided on one. I think your idea is really interesting and not one I've heard before, so I'll present it to the team and see if it might be a good solution.

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As someone who has lost about, if not more, than a month's worth of relic hunting, getting nearly all above level 15, and some over that, I am strongly displeased at the lack of action, still. I am considering whether I should continue to play this game (as opposed to contemplate if I should leave, because that's not in question anymore). As someone who gets 0-15 (10 average) ping, I should not see 1.7k ping show up in my game--and I run solo.
It has been nearly two weeks now, if not more, and I've seen no measures taken to solve or improve this problem in spite of many suggestions; and from my experience (not only from this game), this attitude will continue. I didn't want to leave this game, but I don't have the time to grind for another 200 hours just to get to the relic level I was just on. Seeing as we have no backing from the devs, I don't see how I could trust someone like that to utilise the full potential of this game. I did try my best, but the moment I died and was hinted at the reply "you're not getting it back" was the last thing I wanted to hear when it wasn't even my fault. Don't make another game that when someone asks, "how is it?", the reply is "Amazing! But, with A LOT of bugs, so get used to it." Notice how the latter part of that last quote is longer.

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Posted (edited)

+1 for Tome of Knowledge, or any other method for relic loss becoming a 'decay' mechanic rather than 100-to-0.

People feel compelled to use as many relics as possible since, in theory, using them makes the other pile more secure by decreasing your chance of death.
Exception if you need 20 to gain a level and save 19, but the general mentality is the same and very few people will have relic backups to buffer their death to some lag spike.
Also, relics only stack to 10 for some reason, which means people of higher level can't hoard an appropriately sized backup even if they wanted to.

Also, the Auction House being down means people in that scenario cannot recover through buying relics either, because attempting to buy them in discord or game chat isn't very consistent. So the prospect is to grind forever to break even on a death caused by a lag spike, and secondary progression during that recovery time like silver/mats/charms/etc becomes invisible in comparison with the original loss.

Also, it is especially disturbing to think that someone could die with hundreds or even thousands of relics and be met with a Valr reward less than the total number of relics lost after spending a month (or more) collecting them, while a person suiciding into the well for 1 minute after rushing to 25 gains 100x their reward. The only way for people to reconcile this design flaw is to imagine that anyone farming t9+ has already done a million well runs and has all the cards, including leveling them to 50 (a scenario where someone might have their cards maxed out and no longer have any need for Valr  is another design problem entirely), but this is unlikely to be the case for everyone in t9, especially if they want to change classes to mitigate the pain of losing their character. So then they are put into a position where they not only lost all of their relics, but need to also go into the infinite dicerolling grindfest of well runs to change to a new class and start over, since defeating 5000 t9 dungeons and completing t10 is completely worthless as far as the Valr system is concerned. The death of such a high level character quite literally breaks the game loop, and almost guarantees you lost a player (especially if the death wasn't even their fault to begin with, EA or not).

Edited by paradoxofchoice

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